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New Rules Keep Coming

Andre Levite

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Jun 18, 2018
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Most notable change is when flying around airports hobbyists will need to "request prior authorization" thru LAANC instead of just notifying air traffic control tower.

Kittyhawk and B4Ufly apps will also merge and likely by method of LAANC request

I actually see these as inevitable and improvements. But once this is in place they can easily tighten the screws

Even More New FAA Rules
 
This hobby has gone coo coo. It wont stop. Each year there will be more and more restrictions. I don't even fly my mavic any longer.
 
This hobby has gone coo coo. It wont stop. Each year there will be more and more restrictions. I don't even fly my mavic any longer.
You complicated yourself. I myself find many places that are not restricted. You just need to look around. It maybe a little farther but most of the time it's worthy to drive over.
 
This hobby has gone coo coo. It wont stop. Each year there will be more and more restrictions. I don't even fly my mavic any longer.

I actually think the LAANC will benefit hobbyists in some respects. With the new system you will have digital proof that the airport cleared you. Currently all you can do is get somebody's name over the phone -- you have no documentation of the actual conversation.

B4Ufly is the only official airspace app and it's archaic. The input of Kittyhawk's developers should make the combined app greater than the individual parts.
 
Well at least they have a provision for hobbyists. Hopefully it will be appended to the commercial drone pilot ability to receive LAANC approval through DJI software. That would make it more palatable.

But I must say.., commercial jets and copters fly over my house all day, and I need permission to fly over my yard?!?
 
Well at least they have a provision for hobbyists. Hopefully it will be appended to the commercial drone pilot ability to receive LAANC approval through DJI software. That would make it more palatable.

But I must say.., commercial jets and copters fly over my house all day, and I need permission to fly over my yard?!?

YES! The helicopters and planes flying over your house are the very reason you need clearance -- you are sharing the same airspace.

The LAANC will not be done thru DJI Go app because DJI are only one of many manufacturers. FAA's B4Ufly app is merging into Kittyhawk and is expected to be the primary means of LAANC clearance.
 
But I must say.., commercial jets and copters fly over my house all day, and I need permission to fly over my yard?!?

Yes! Especially considering that I would gladly fly low
I even get restricted when trying to fly inside my own house!

YES! The helicopters and planes flying over your house are the very reason you need clearance -- you are sharing the same airspace..

and, no, we do not share the same airspace! they should be flying over 400 feet and I want to fly much lower.
if the FAA had any common sense, they would not even regulate the airspace between 0 and 50 feet...
 
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Yes! Especially considering that I would gladly fly low
I even get restricted when trying to fly inside my own house!



and, no, we do not share the same airspace! they should be flying over 400 feet and I want to fly much lower.
if the FAA had any common sense, they would not even regulate the airspace between 0 and 50 feet...

There are many exceptions when manned aircraft can fly below 400 feet and they need to know if there are any drones in the area. Additionally the tower must know where drones are flying when manned aircraft have emergencies. Ask a pilot - it's not uncommon - there's sound reasoning behind the regulations (even the ones we don't like).
 
and, no, we do not share the same airspace! they should be flying over 400 feet and I want to fly much lower.
It's is not you they are concerned about. They can trust you to comply with all their rules and never (not even by accident) fly over 400 ft. It's your stupid neighbour, who lets his even more stupid friends fly the drone during a BBQ-party in the garden and who think it's fun to see if they can film aircraft from above.

I was being sarcastic of course, but not quite: unfortunately people can't be trusted with stuff that's dangerous. Most people will be sensible and intelligent and considering. But not all.
 
In the UK from 13th March they are introducing a range of Drone legislation including a no-fly zone within 5 miles of an airport (up from 1 mile).
 
unfortunately people can't be trusted with stuff that's dangerous.

Mmmm Yes, just look at what the government does with all their dangerous stuff!
 
Mmmm Yes, just look at what the government does with all their dangerous stuff!
There's no point in using a what-about-ism. Your point only re-establishes the fact that people in general can't be trusted with something powerfull or dangerous. Government consists of people elected by people. Government just has bigger toys to play with.
 
There's no point in using a what-about-ism.

There is likewise no point in virtue signaling or jingoism such as the term "what-about -isms". Leave the quasi reality of political correctness behind and come down and play in the dirt of the real world with the rest of us.

Rights are self existent and are there for owned by each individual from birth, they are not bestowed by Government or legislation and my right to do as I please or own what I wish can not be reasoned away by Government or individuals under the tyrannies such as justifications "for the public good" or "people can not be trusted".

I am sorry sir but your trust is irrelevant if indeed true liberty exists regardless that apologists for oppressive big government would wish it to be otherwise.

Government consists of people elected by people

If you really believe this I can only refer you to Plato's "5 forms of government" from which it is plain that what the U.S., the U.K. and Australia have is not democracy but rather "Two party Oligarchy". Or perhaps read the words of Lord Acton

"The one pervading evil of democracy is the tyranny of the majority, or rather of that party not always the majority, that succeeds, by force or fraud, in carrying elections".

All forms of government consist of the majority imposing their will upon the minority by force if need be.

Of most pertinence in this case however

There's no point in taking everything I say so seriously. Like many Australians I'm notorious for taking the P*ss out of everything and rather than attempt to sacrifice me on the alter of social correctness you would be better served at recognising an attempt at raising a laugh.

Regards
Ari
 
But I must say.., commercial jets and copters fly over my house all day, and I need permission to fly over my yard?!?

And commercial jets and copters are under layers of regulations and authorization before they even get off the ground. Your hobby is the flat surface of the totem pole contacting the ground.
 
There are many exceptions when manned aircraft can fly below 400 feet and they need to know if there are any drones in the area. Additionally the tower must know where drones are flying when manned aircraft have emergencies. Ask a pilot - it's not uncommon - there's sound reasoning behind the regulations (even the ones we don't like).

but what about the altitudes from zero to, say, 50 feet. At this point, the terrain itself, houses, trees, towers, etc. presents a danger to any aircraft and really the ATC has no business separating UAVs and other aircraft in that space.
 
There is likewise no point in virtue signaling or jingoism such as the term "what-about -isms". Leave the quasi reality of political correctness behind and come down and play in the dirt of the real world with the rest of us.
....
Regards
Ari
I am clearly out of my league here, not only in the use of english (which is not my first or native language), my mastering of ancient wisdom, but also in the deep-felt negative emotions regarding a governemental structure that most of us call democracy. Living in a country where government in general is trusted (except during parties where alcohol replaces reasoning) I have a hard time relating to your anguish (I do admint however that Trump makes having doubts a little easier)

But, in your desire to impose on me your views on the world in general and your government in particular, you have not addressed my point: government is no different from ordinary people in that they can not be trusted with dangerous toys.
 
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Hi Multikoe

I sense the need to remove some sting from my comments. In my defense I did reply at 4am local time so just fired off a reply from the top of my head and may not have taken the time or effort to be as diplomatic as I should have been.

I am clearly out of my league here, not only in the use of english (which is not my first or native language)

You are far too harsh on yourself, I did not pick that English is not your native language. I speak other languages myself but none of them as well as you speak English so you outmatch me there.

my mastering of ancient wisdom

While it is probably obvious that I do have a classical education and am disgustingly well read I make no claims to "Master" anything. I do my best, I think deeply on things but am as likely to be wrong as the next person.

but also in the deep-felt negative emotions regarding a governemental structure that most of us call democracy

Once again, I'm obviously a student of history (and I also have a near eidetic memory) so I carry along with me a wealth of trivia and detail in history that is usually useless but occasionally comes in handy.

We are all taught in school how democracy was invented by the ancient Greeks. What our educators do not like to teach us was that it was considered a "failed experiment" and little more than "mob rule" and was discarded after 117 years and not seen again in it's modern form until almost 2000 years later.

In principle Democracy is a fine idea, In principle so is Socialism or Communism. Sadly in practice all systems are administered by human being with all of their failings and weakness for corruptions of many kinds. So in practice I treat governments of any kind like sharks. They are only dangerous when you take your eyes off them.

You are correct, While I greatly like people individually, in large groups I am cautious and towards the large structures in which they construct to rule others (Governments) I do indeed have a "deeply-felt negative emotion". It's called distrust ... or perhaps better looked at as "self preservation". I neither need or recognise any authority greater than my own moral compass. In the words of the characters of the author Robert Heinlein "In so far as I find Government tolerable I tolerate it, when I don't I do not."

Fortunately better than 98.5% of the time what I discern as being right matches up with what society in the form of our Government sees as being right.

Living in a country where government in general is trusted

You are indeed fortunate, I wonder if the majority of your fellow citizens share your trust? I sadly live in a country which claims to be a democracy yet where the people have no bill of rights and do not have the right to free speech protected in the constitution or law.

I have a hard time relating to your anguish (I do admint however that Trump makes having doubts a little easier)

Anguish is too strong a word, distrust is adequate. I am glad for you that you do not have need to be so on guard.

As far as Mr Trump, I generally try to avoid political comment in public forums due to the upset it can cause. This time I'll be a little daring. Let us just say that here in Australia we sadly tend to throw out our heads of state about twice a year for silly reasons recently but on the other hand we haven't elected an allegedly corrupt, undeniable sociopathic troll doll in the early stages of dementia to our highest office ... shall we call it a draw? XD

But, in your desire to impose on me your views on the world in general and your government in particular, you have not addressed my point: government is no different from ordinary people in that they can not be trusted with dangerous toys.

Now, let's be reasonable here. "Acquaint you with my views"?, "Share with you my views"?, those I will accept. "IMPOSE on you" my views? Both incorrect and unfair. I am the seventh generation of my family to serve the crown and fight for the right of people to hold views that do not agree with my own. I most strongly uphold your right to disagree with me. Here's another quote for you. "It is the measure of the freedom of our society that we allow those who we most despise to have their say". I don't despise you or have any negative emotion towards you of course but the quote encapsulates my beliefs.

I must admit that I missed your implication that Government can be trusted no more than the individual, but you missed the fact that my initial comment was in wry humour. Shall we call that even also?

Sir, while I take on board your point we are going to have to agree to disagree because as I stated above, your trust or the Government's trust is to my eyes without relevance. My natural rights are not constrained or limited by your any anyone's trust. I may and will do as I see fit and own that which I see fit (short of weapons of mass destruction and the like of course) until such time as I use those rights to trespass upon the rights of others. At that point I expect you to come after me or the Government to come after me.

So let us steer back to the point.

Most of the regulations mentioned here that irk people, they do not apply to me in my own country. I can fly in controlled airspace, I can fly right up to the movement area of a controlled aerodrome as long as I am radio communication with the tower and stay below 150Ft and I keep away from 15º of the approach and departure angle.

I can authorise for myself or my employees flights at night, over crowds and even obtain permission to fly in restricted areas and over 400Ft and much else. How? Because I took the time and spent considerable effort and many thousands of dollars to obtain my Remote Pilots Licence, my Aeronautical Radio Operators Certificate and a Remote Operators Certificate for my company. In my country I am not considered so much a "Commercial Drone Operator" but as a low grade pilot. I am trained in and have been examined in the same aeronautical laws, practices and requirements as a regular pilot, I can communicate with Air Traffic Control and other pilots of manned aviation and the Remote Operators Certificate shows I have proven myself capable to do Job Safety Analysis and put in place Risk mitigation and Threat and Error management practices to make non standard flights allowable.

If people are finding new rules to be objectionable or restrictive I strongly suggest to them to undertake the training and obtain the qualifications that will allow you to operate unrestrained by those rules. Most countries have a mechanism for this.

I also hope this demonstrates that while I do not support the idea that your, the Government's or anyone elses's trust should limit what I can do or own I do recognise the obligation upon me to excercise my rights in a safe way for the public and the desirability to aquire the knowledge and the qualifications to do so in a regulated environment. That in mind I hope you will see that while I may be "anti establishment" I don't think I could be thought of as an anarchist either.

I do apologise for the wall of words and taking us so far off thread, on the other hand I hope that I have clarified my views in a reasonable manner and removed any offense my reply gave you.

Regards
Ari
 
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Hi Multikoe

....

I do apologise for the wall of words and taking us so far off thread, on the other hand I hope that I have clarified my views in a reasonable manner and removed any offense my reply gave you.

Regards
Ari
You did, and I enjoyed reading your post. You seem a reasonable person and conversing with you is enlightening. I do, however, think that we digressed a bit outside the virtual boundary which defines this forum, so, with your approval, let's depart with mutual respect and shared admiration to everything with wings :)
 
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but what about the altitudes from zero to, say, 50 feet. At this point, the terrain itself, houses, trees, towers, etc. presents a danger to any aircraft and really the ATC has no business separating UAVs and other aircraft in that space.


Unfortunately you are 100% correct and the FAA agrees with you.

In the near future they may very well restrict hobbyists to below 50 feet altitude and sell the valuable 50-400' airspace to commercial drone entities. It's worth tens of millions of dollars and only sparsely used by a handful of us. We should enjoy it while we can because some powerful and wealthy groups will be fighting over it shortly.
 
sell the valuable 50-400' airspace to commercial drone entities. It's worth tens of millions of dollars and only sparsely used by a handful of us. We should enjoy it while we can because some powerful and wealthy groups will be fighting over it shortly.

Right on target!
 

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